Rwanda Votes on its Kill the Gays Bill, Zimbabwe Kicks the Gays Out of School

road-repairs-borderRWANDA: Rwanda votes on criminalization of homosexuality today“Rwanda.  Yes, Rwanda. When I first saw the email heading, I thought it might be wrong.” I thought so too, but it’s not. [FYI Rwanda, a sub-Saharan country, is directly south of Uganda.] The lower house of Parliament will be voting Wednesday on a bill that would criminalize homosexuality for the first time in the country’s history. (@rh reality check)

And of course Rick Warren is involved: “If Rick Warren was willing to condemn Uganda’s gay genocide and criminalization bill, which he said he had no hand in, he should have zero problem condemning a bill supported by his personal friend, President [of Rwanda] Paul Kagame… The American people provide life-saving aid to Rwanda.” (@phb)

You can also find more about the situation for gays in Rwanda at this website I just discovered called GlobalGayz which features info (some of it is a year old or older, but still) about gay rights and travel all over the world. If you can get past the Comic Sans you f*cking snobs, you will learn a lot! (@globalgayz)

ZIMBABWE ON MY MIND: Two Dominican Convent High School students in Bulawayo fell in love. And then they got expelled from their Roman Catholic school. This isn’t an unusual event, as it happens worldwide all the time, but that “although Zimbabwe does not tolerate homosexuality, people have continued to engage in the practice” line summarizing the action is chilling. The most interesting part of this article is the persistent reporter character who describes being denied interviews from various school officials as if he actually could’ve possibly expected any of them to wanna sit down and dish about the lezzies (@sundaynews):

When a Sunday News crew went to the school on Friday last week to seek a comment from the headmistress, its reporter was barred from entering school offices.

According to the ilga, male-to-male sex is illegal in Zimbabwe but female-to-female sex is legal.

IMMIGRATION: A Daily Kos blogger makes plans to leave the country: Her girlfriend, a UK citizen, is here on a limited work visa and now that visa has expired. If they were straight, they could get married and stay together. But they’re not. So the girlfriend is either going to have to leave America (likely), break up, or do long distance. Find out about the The Uniting American Families Act (UAFA) which, if it ever gets anywhere, could help people like her.

NEW YORK SAME-SEX MARRIAGE: Most people in New York State aren’t happy about same-sex marriage losing last week: “Forty-seven percent of voters were disappointed that the Senate rejected the bill to legalize same sex marriages in New York, compared to 41 percent who were pleased by the Senate’s vote. Liberals, young voters, Democrats and Jewish voters were most disappointed.”gay-marriage-ny

MATTHEW SHEPARD: “Every so often you stumble upon something in the interwebs and think, “How the hell didn’t I see this before?” Such is the case with this interview with Matthew Shepard, which comes from the 1998 documentary Dear Jesse. At the time, Shepard was a student at Catawba College, in North Carolina, before moving to Wyoming. Shepard is interviewed, along with his then boyfriend Lewis Krider, as part of Dear Jesse’s focus on being openly gay deep in the heart of Senator Jesse Helms country.” (@change.org)

HILLARY: Hillary Clinton: The Most Pro-LGBT Secretary of State Ever. (@change.org)

TRANSGENDER RIGHTS: Transgender state employees receive protection in New York“Though state antidiscrimination law includes gay men and lesbians, it is silent on the issue of transgender people. And while Mr. Paterson’s order will not have the sweep of a statute enacted by the State Legislature because it will apply only to state agencies, gay and transgender rights advocates said it would be a first step toward including gender identity and expression protections in state law.” (@new york times)

GAY SOLDIERS: A British soldier comes out in Afghanistan – Attention all pro-DADT-ers: “Trooper Ben Rakestrow said he’s received nothing but friendly banter from fellow soldiers since telling them last year he picked a guy up at a gay club.” (@mcv)

DISCRIMINATION: The Vatican speaks out against “Unjust” discriminationFr. Bené explained to LSN that “‘The Church distinguishes between just and unjust discrimination.’ He used the example of his 10-year-old niece not being permitted to marry – a situation, which, although clearly discrimination of a kind, ‘is just discrimination, because she’s not old enough.”  He added: “Discrimination is not a bad thing in itself, but it has been interpreted that way.’” (@life site news)

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Laura is a tiny girl who wishes she were a superhero. She likes talking to her grandma on the phone and making things with her hands. Strengths include an impressive knowledge of Harry Potter, the ability to apply sociology to everything under the sun, and a knack for haggling for groceries in Spanish. Weaknesses: Chick-fil-a, her triceps, girls in glasses, and the subjunctive mood. Follow the vagabond adventures of Laura and her bike on twitter [@laurrrrita].

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76 Comments

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    As an African myself, I fully understand that African culture is threatened by the new global ethic which aggressively seeks to persuade African governments and communities to accept new and different meanings of the concepts of family, marriage and human sexuality. This is a cultural challenge. We face a second wave of colonialism, both subtle and ruthless at the same time. As an African I have a duty and obligation to protect my values from Western contamination and intellectual cynicism.
    Just as we defeated slavery, colonialism, and apartheid, this challenge will be overcome. A few people will always side with these colonial agents. The aim of these laws is to give these agents a final blow and restore our values.
    As usual, in the end –AFRICA WILL PREVAIL

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      Wow.

      Your credibility just went from zero to negative 50 million.

      Well Olal Otunu, by embracing legislation that will criminalize an entire race of people just because of who they are, you’ve proven yourself no different from colonialists. You accept colonialism when it serves your interests. In fact, since you make this agenda of genocide your own “duty and obligation”, you’ve taken it upon yourself to become a colonialist, the very thing you supposedly abhor.

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          That rationale is just being a oppressive tyrant towards a group of people who mean you no harm and simply wish to live in the same society you do.

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          Dagra Dai,

          seems you’re “taking me on” but look. . . Every human has the right to live and to education,… basic things. But I honestly don’t think that just because someone cries “foul play” we should always stop and “give them the rights”(because somewhere else in the world it does happen). We have to look into the context of those rights without forgetting that the African arena (in most cases) is very different from any other in world. I insist, very different!

          In the US some states are at ease with homosexuality while others at radically opposed (blacks, whites, hispanics,..all together).
          So,
          1)Your comparison with “blacks rights-I guess- is distorted”
          2) This resentment is not something “from Africans”!
          3) I am not a control freak because I lay down facts you may hard time with. If I said the same thing about you, I wouldn’t be wrong.

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          Late as I may be my outspoken gene won’t allow me to not say something here. Olal Otunu you might want to listen to Degra Dai and Ian. “Protecting” you values is all fine and dandy, but I believe you’ve overstepped the line. Try to understand–and I’ve never been able to see why this idea is so hard to translate for the highly opposed–letting the LGBT community exist has NOTHING to do with your values. It won’t change you. I think the main problem is your fear that someone this will do something to affect your life, I promise, it won’t. You’re going to be straight until the day you die. No one is sending the gay army to your house to convert you. Most importantly, regardless of you “values” (which you may need to reevaluate) it is NO ONE’s job to take someone’s life, and trying to protect what you believe in should never go to that extreme. These are people’s LIVES. Living breathing people. Whether you think there’s something wrong with them or not. I’ve never understood how strong-headed Africans, African-Africans, and Caribbeans can be when it comes to LGBT matters, simply because I feel like coming from lands that have been time and time again raped for their fortunes and furthermore oppressed both on and off their homeland, there should be some sensitivity. If nothing else, we should be tired of oppression, I know I am. One last thing for you specifically, you’re only furthering the colonialism, dear.

          Huan, are you REALLY comparing gays to pedophiles? I’ve heard that in countries like Jamaica and Trinidad (from which I hail) the biggest misconception and therefor one of the main reasons they stone gays freely is because they associate homosexuality with pedophilia. You seem well-read enough that you should have escaped this ignorance by now. I can’t believe I have to even say this, they are not related. Pedophilia is wrong, not even because of how sick it is, but mainly because you can’t sexually approach a child, they don’t have the power to give consent or refuse a sexual act when they have no knowledge of it and have not developed sexual desires yet. Therefor any sexual acts directed toward a charge is by force or consent-less. Pedophiles don’t need rights.

          If anything, all of those hailing from African continue to disappoint me. I have been watching, waiting for peace in that continent, pulling for it, because I know in the end my lineage is traced there. But I cannot understand how there can be SO MUCH strife over there, and someone how they still manage to wanna wreck the peace. This is causing more damage. The dust will never settle. I am disgusted.

          And yes, every human does have the right to education. Every human also has the right to LIVE. None of us are God, we cannot decide when its someones time to leave this earth.

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          DemiArianna,

          The truth remains the truth even if it’s one person who speaks. It’s a transcendental.

          Biologically speaking (whether you believe in Evolution or creation) the female and male parts are meant for each other given their respective locations and shapes and actually the actions they accomplish, TOGETHER. That’s the standard. If a dude landed in the armpit of woman – let alone another man’s behind- it would be some kind of deviation. Why? Because it is not meant to be there!

          Pedophilia is considered a deviation because it’s used in a way that’s far from the norm. The armpit example fits here perfectly! From a biological viewpoint homosexuality fits this description perfectly and hence it’s a deviation as well!

          In Rwanda here’s what we mean ” You wanna be gay? Sure! Knock yourself out! BUT,….BUT,….don’t try to make us believe that we have to embrace your ways or that we can describe you in a way that suits your hearing than the way you actually are”! A deviant according the RWANDESE SOCIETY NOT US or CANADA or Germany,…RWANDA!

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          Huan, your point is totally invalid. Homosexual sex is a “deviation” of “standard” sex, if you say so, whatever. Where does this grant you the right to have people killed? What does that have to do with anything being right or wrong? You’re frankly just talking out of your ass, in circles might I add.

          Have you never heard of a spectrum? Because you’re only seeing extremes here, you only think in black and white I see. What you don’t seem to understand is that you’re promoting to kill. Here, let’s directly analyze:
          You said the following: “In Rwanda here’s what we mean ” You wanna be gay? Sure! Knock yourself out! BUT,….BUT,….don’t try to make us believe that we have to embrace your ways or that we can describe you in a way that suits your hearing than the way you actually are”!”

          I’m not sure who in Rwanda could be trying to make you “embrace” per se, but regardless, calling for murder is an EXTREME answer. Do you get what I’m saying now? Even if you are highly opposed to someone trying to make you tolerate, couldn’t there be some much less harmful way to react. It’s not even like the bill says “we’ll throw you in jail” (which would still be wrong), it calls for MURDER. You know, as in death? No longer living? Hearts stopping? Nod your head if you understand.

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          HUAN YOU ARE CRAZY.

          Every human being deserves rights except for a human being who has violated the desires and free will of another human being. For example, a person who kills another person = does not deserve rights.

          a person who has molested a child = bad
          a person who has sex with another person of the same gender who also desires sex with that person = a-ok

          a person who has paid for sex with an enslaved underage sex worker ‘employed’ against her will = bad
          a person who has paid for sex with a willing sex worker or call girl who is working for money and not specifically for drug money = a-ok.

          etc.

          There is a golden rule. G-d doesn’t need to say it. Do unto others as you would have them do onto yourself. Don’t violate people, and you will be blessed.

          HUAN, no one can tell another person not to do something that doesn’t hurt anyone else. Just respect yourself and your fellow man. Civilization, in turn, will thrive.

          Thanks for reading!

          p.s. demi arianna i love your outspoken gene

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          Oh thank you. Psh, at least someone likes it.

          And just for fun, I just bought a shirt that has “do unto others and you would have them do onto yourself” on it. I got it from threadless. It fits well, thanks for asking.

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    Olal Otunu, you complain about colonialism.

    Do you not understand that the people behind this push for anti gay legislation in several African nations are in fact evangelical Christians from the USA?

    Is one form of colonialism ok with you so long as you agree with its aims personally?

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      Yeah thanks Ian! I thought the same thing reading that comment that I can’t believe this is what people are thinking now. Colonialism in Africa, designed and carried out by evangelical christian missionaries, sought to convert Africans — “save” them — from what the colonialists determined was a lesser form of being. They imposed a certain interpretation of Christian values which included opposition to homosexuality or anything outside of the ‘traditional’ family system. It’s these same Americans, descendants of the first Colonialist wave, who are now exporting hate to Africa. I hope that this challenge can be overcome as well, and that enemies are seen as enemies and people desiring peace and love are seen as allies.

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        “Before slavery in the USA we had no blacks. Before we began exploring the western frontier we had no blacks. Why should we then? JUST WHY?”

        You see how sick and pathetic that sounds? It’s no different from what you said.

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        I have to admit I had to do some light research before asking this question and I know it won’t bring any interesting points but, Huan, how can you state that fact so surely?

        Also, homosexuality and pedophilia aren’t even comparable. They don’t even sound alike! (hemophilia and pedophilia do sound alike though)

        I still don’t understand your point. And you mention the word “deviation” as if it always means something bad. A deviation is just something different from the standard. We are talking about consenting adults, not minors. What’s your argument then? Is it the “deviation” thing again? That’s just not strong enough, really. Build a better argument and I would love to read it. Honestly. 4 sure.

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    as another african, i’m once again questioning this prevailing attitude amongst many africans that same sex relationships were imported from the west. i’m a lesbian and african, as is my ex partner, and we both know a veritable multitude of other africans, male and female who identify as gay and lesbian. it’s not something that we chose to assimilate from western cultures, nor did we have it imposed on us by anyone – it’s who we are and who we have always been. how many tales were told in the past about great great aunts and the like who chose to co-habit with ‘a friend’ and nobody saw fit to challenge them or accuse them of being un-african. there’s nothing un-african about being gay, it’s as natural as breathing to me, i don’t have a choice in who i choose to be attracted to, or fall in love with – that’s as much a part of me as my chocolate brown skin and kinky black hair. you can legislate or discriminate as much as you want, it wont make one iota of a difference to me, that’s who i am, and that’ how god made me.

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      Exactly mandisa! Exactly! Same-sex relationships are as natural as breathing to gays & lesbians all over the world. It’s the prejudice that has been imported from the West moreso than anything.

      Thank you for commenting!

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      Exactly Mandisa and Reise. I am not sure about other African countries but the law in Zimbabwe which outlaws homosexuality but ignores Lesbianism is directly inherited from the colonial British government who never bothered to question Queen Victoria’s refusal to believe that lesbians exist. As a white African Lesbian, whose family are also Catholic, I have found homophobia from all sections of Zimbabwean society and am completely sure that if homophobic brain washing worked, I would be straight! Good on Harare for having a Gay and Lesbian centre long after London, where homosexuality is legal.

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      Mandisa, which part of Africa are you from? You can’t choose who to be attracted to you say?

      Listen, if you choose to be attracted to a teenage boy/girl I will be the first one to take action. It’s deviation the standard. Ok? You have rights BUT RIGHTS come with responsibilities as well!

      Being “openly gay” is as being “openly pedophile” or “openly with animals”. It’s a deviation, and I am terribly sorry to knock you down that hard. Sorry,… the truth hurts

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        Yes, the truth does hurt. Like the fact that you are a miserable control freak who thinks he can treat people like trash because of who they are.

        You’re finished, Huan. Credibility spent. Get lost.

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          @ TwO of my friends is lesbian AND I respect their way but I don’t think they should push it on everyone to accept it. Thankfully they don’t, and can get along with me with my radical views on the subject. Why? Because they simply understand that someone has the right to view homosexuality from another angle than the “gay pride” it pushing everyone to embrace. That’s being realistic and real. Everything else is just fanaticism!

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          Ah, yes, so now homosexuality = pedophilia = beastiality? No one is forcing you to do anything in reality. If there were no anti-gay laws in Uganda, the straights will still be straight. They will still go about living their lives. No one is forcing anyone to “embrace” anything, by all means don’t go hugging gays, but seriously, just let it be. “Tolerate” if you have to. Besides, you aren’t just refusing to embrace it, you are promoting a conducted genocide. There’s a difference between denying someone’s right and killing them, obviously. I mean seriously, not only do you not think we should have rights but you are supporting a law to KILL. Its not like you’re just saying “no you can’t have right”, its more like “no you can’t have rights, in fact we’re just gonna murder you.” And for your supposed two lesbian friends, you have no respect for them, quite clearly. Don’t declare that.

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    Another website about LGBT issues in a global context is internationalspectrum.umich.edu. It has sections on intl students adjusting to queer life in the US, LGBT students going abroad, in addition to many links to region-specific pages on LGBT life outside of the US. GlobalGayz is a great site, too! (disclosure: I created this during my internship)

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    Mandisa, I completely agree with you about attraction not being a choice, it isn’t. I hope your words may get through to some of the people who are in favour of these anti gay bills.

    I wish you all the very best.

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    “Discrimination is not a bad thing in itself, but it has been interpreted that way.”

    I hope this guys isn’t as ignorant as he sounds, but I’m interpreting it that way.

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      I’ve been feeling that way too. I’m kind of worried for Canada too. We were recently scarily close to illegalizing abortion because of the “Unborn Victims of Crime Act” which made it through as a private members bill, but ended up getting shut down.
      http://ca.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idCAN0625185820080306
      According to the MP who introduced it, it has nothing to do with abortion, but the way the legal system works, if a fetus has rights you can’t really only apply that to certain kinds of violent crime.

      THANKFULLY: the bill was aborted (see what I did there?)

  7. Pingback: Rwanda Votes on its Kill the Gays Bill, Zimbabwe Kicks the Gays … QV China

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    The world isn’t going backwards, but it is certainly a very disjointed point in our present. We’re living through a very confused time, but this is all going to be worth it. Look at Houston and DC. Look at autostraddle. We are making strides! Don’t stop believin’, etc.
    Side note: comic sans used to be my default font circa 1998.

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    This is not the direction we’re not supposed to be going in. I feel like I’m in the twilight zone. Am I here alone? Is anyone else seeing this madness? This is like one of those dreams where everything is topsy turvy and no one can see or hear you when you’re begging them to stop…

    Anyway. It’s funny that it says “get past the comic sans” because I would have been the very person to be like “ugh! I can’t take this font seriously” lmao. I guess I am a “f*ucking snob”.

    Gay sex is illegal, but lesbian sex isn’t? If that isn’t the most sexist shit I’ve ever heard… Really, Zimbabwe?

    Maybe Lamba Legal can help that couple with the immigration problem? I don’t know too much about them, but this really official lady came to my Prejudice and Persecution class in high school and she really meant business. Or they could just get Joyce Wishnia.

    That photo gives me a tad bit of hope for my city, just a tad bit.

    Hilary said: “Governments should be expected to resist the temptation to restrict freedom of expression when criticism arises, and be vigilant in preventing law from becoming an instrument of oppression, as bills like the one under consideration in Uganda to criminalize homosexuality would do,” and that’s just beautiful.

    I’m gonna be the girl that Tasha is telling her Iraq friends about, that she picked up at a club.

    “Discrimination is not a bad thing”? What you been sippin’?

    Speaking of sippin’, I’m definitely under the slight influence at the moment, “tipsy” if you will. And at work. Yes, we drink at work sometimes. It gets crazy in herreee.

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      Indeed! That was sadly my first reaction on hearing about the bill in Uganda: no surprise. Gay (and Ugandan) as I am and as seriously troubling as this bill is, if I had an hour’s actual influential face-time with ‘the powers that be’ I’m not even sure I’d get round to the anti-homosexuality bill for all the other crises chronic in Ugandan govt and society.

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      Another South African representing here… yes, we have bigger problems to worry about than homo’s. That said, our constitution is one of the most progressive in the world. Its illegal to discriminate against any person on grounds of homosexuality (yes, illegal), and we can marry each other. YAY SA!
      I think the solution to the problem is for all lesbians to move here… come on, the weather is good :) I’m awaiting the lezzie influx.

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        Lol, that made me smile aneke, thanks.

        Yes, it really really should be the least of the worries, as I think it should be everywhere. I think the amount of time spent arguing and getting worked up over this makes no sense. This shouldn’t be an issue anywhere, because everywhere has bigger problems than this. It shouldn’t be an issue! Let people be. I mean even here in America, the fact that it is taking so long for rights to come about and we spend so much time fighting things like Prop 8 and pushing for bills is crazy. We have bigger issues, we shouldn’t have to fight about this. What about this damned recession or our terrible health care system? Sheesh.

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    At first glance I thought the headline said, “Rhianna Votes…” For a split second I thought some genius decided to put Rhianna in charge; then I got sad when I read it a second time.

    What is up with ignorant people these days? It feels like they’ve got some underground SOS system that’s telling them to come out in droves to ruin the world because it’s getting too smart for them & they’re losing control… oh wait, that sounds like Fox’s mission… they’re probably also backing this insane parent: http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/sexist/2009/12/15/parent-files-complaint-against-gay-teacher-over-childs-sense-of-innocence/

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    Leave the Rwandans decide for themselves, after all when they cried out you were nowhere to be seen and help. Now you’re coming to feed us your “human compassion” for homos? Ohhh please! Homosexuals are deviants and should be taken as such instead of being “petted”…FULL STOP.

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    I don’t wanna date a girl who’s been raised by two dudes! She’d most probably have a mentality far from anything “lady like”. Think about it!

    Human sexuality is NOT SOMETHING TO MESS AROUND WITH because there are so many deviations and each branch would explain “they don’t choose who they are attracted to”. Failure to be hard at such decision paves the way to a confused society heading straight to its own knees!

    This is not an African thing. It’s a Universal truth…

    ************** HOMOSEXUALITY ******** BIG NO NO NO *******

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      “She’d most probably have a mentality far from anything ‘lady like’.”?

      Jesus Christ, no wonder you don’t have a girlfriend. Not only do you lick your chops at the idea of murdering your own people for no other reason than because of who they are, but you hate women who don’t act a certain way that appeals to you. And you wonder why people on this site aren’t being complacent with what you say?

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        Dagra Dai,

        they don’t have to accept and embrace what I say. By the way, if you’re so civilized, learn manners to have a less “agitated” conversation and leave me the right to see things differently than you and if you’re smart, you should have realized I won’t be shaken by a wimp like you who can’t stand others different views! Talk about being a wussy control freak yo!

        PS: I don’t hate women you twat! My mother, sisters and fiancee are decent and lovely women among the many I have at heart! Don’t you even dare say that nonsense again. EVER!!

        SOME PEOPLE WILL NEVER UNDERSTAND HOMOSEXUALS OR ACCEPT THEIR WAY NO MATTER WHAT AND I THINK IT’S PERFECTLY THEIR RIGHT, MUCH THE SAME WAY THE OPPOSITE IS TRUE!

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          Hat tips:

          1) Using all caps at the end of all your comments isn’t going to help convince anyone that I’m more “agitated” than you are.

          2) Resorting to insults by calling me a twat isn’t going to convince anyone that you don’t hate women.

          3) You need to explain why you accept the genocide of your own people. Saying some people will never understand homosexuals is not enough. There’s no justice in killing.

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          I agree I went too far by insulting you and I do apologize. Some people will never understand homosexuality just because there will always be some bias about it. There will always be people ready to believe in a higher Creator and others who simply won’t as long as human exists. So, the same way we can’t force everybody to believe anything, nobody will ever convince me( and a lot more people) because I think that from the biological stand point alone it’s even unbelievably stubborn to argue about it! In Electricity we know live conduction and live conduction produce a short circuit.

          Standard: Live conduction is connected to earth conduction.

          Standard: Man should be connected to woman or vice versa.

          Deviation from standard: Live to live and earth to earth conduction!

          Deviation from standard: Man to man and Woman to woman.

          Deviation from standard: Adult to kid!

          Deviation from standard: Man/woman to animal or robot or whatever!

          That’s the truth independently of what I call it or you call it. It remains the TRUTH even if it was spoken only by one person in the entire world.

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          Look at you. You hate homosexuals so much that you don’t even refer to them as human beings. You hate them so much that you refer to them as deviants. You have to reinforce the thought that homosexuals are vastly different from heterosexuals. Also, you need to lose the ego. Stop telling us that everything you say is the truth and will remain the truth no matter how far off the planet you go.

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          Degra,

          for the last time, please don’t try to pin on me the “hater connotation” because I have a different view than yours. If I say a pedophile is deviant do I imply they are not human? Come onnn you know better than that. I suppose!

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          I was reading the about us and was shocked…

          “Autostraddle is an intelligent, hilarious & provocative voice and a progressive international online community for a new generation of kickass lesbian, bisexual & otherwise inclined ladies.”

          “otherwise inclined ladies” being the key phrase. That is, it is not a community for one’s rights, it’s just an aggregation of rebels to the traditional womanly values!

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          I see. Thank you for your interpretation. And while I’d love to keep in touch and explain why this statement makes no sense either, I have a pretty busy day ahead, we’re going to go to Home Depot. Yeah, buy some wallpaper, maybe get some flooring, stuff like that. Maybe Bed, Bath, & Beyond, I don’t know, I don’t know if we’ll have enough time.

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          huan, why are you including yourself in “us”? you aren’t interested in helping build our community, all you’ve done is attack it.

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          “About us” as about the site. I am sure you’re educated enough to understand I am not including myself at all. Also I am not attacking the community. I am voicing my views that are probably a lot more radical than the average visitor-should I say- but I am not attacking nobody!

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          Huan.
          Thank you for your opinion.
          I’d just like to remind you that the bible has been used to oppress black people for centuries with the belief that they are a “deviation” from the “standard” of white people.
          Do you believe that this judgment was right?

          Also, “rebels to the traditional womanly values”?
          So you are saying we rebel against the gender binary, and the treatment of women as second class citizens, of women as gentle helpless beings with only the function of being pretty and having babies, and as property of men, then yes I suppose we are rebels.

          Please keep in mind, that this site is an online of community for women who identify as such, and you are the sole person in the conversation who defies these opinions.
          YOU ARE NOT GOING TO WIN.
          You say that we can’t expect you to accept up, well since this is a website for GAYS were not going to accept your ANTI-GAY attitude.
          If you want some people to agree with you, go find yourself, some religious zealots or a nazi group.
          Thanks.

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          Yes, you are attacking the community. You’ve stated that homosexuals should just shut up and let people like you do whatever you want to them, and you’ve dismissed and downgraded this website, which is an insult to the people who run it. You haven’t made any friends here. In fact, I think you made up that stuff you said to DemiArianna earlier. I don’t think you have lesbian friends in real life. Who would want to be friends with someone who has written the drivel you have written?

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          Get over the fact that I do have lesbian friends. I didn’t come here to make friends. I came here to give my view points! If you are used to fighting so much for homosexuals, I think you’ve picked the wrong strategy and definitely the wrong person to mess with!

          If this website is open, well Dagra, it’s open even to views like mine amongst people like you. Look at Lexi’s comment above yours. I think it’s more educated though it has some extremism in too!

          @Lexi: My attitude is NOT ANTI-GAY. It is simply that if homosexuality is the norm wherever you live, let it stop there! In Rwanda – remember this is about the Rwanda case – it’s not something acceptable and will not be for a long time, probably never due to the traditional values of our society and those of our neighbours! Try the Congo for instance…
          Oh About women…right.. right. While European and North American women were being oppressed, in Japan women often have dominated every aspect of life For centuries. From what I know the world is not only America and Europe. If you think the homosexuality movement is to be liken to the women’s emancipation period post world war 2, you should reconsider that thought. It’s like saying “My neighbor has told her German shepherd dog to quiet up and I will do the same with my little wild chihuahua”. “It’s both fighting for one’s right”. Right? Wait for the men who think polygamy is their right to join the game! And where do we draw the line?

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          By refusing to let gay people be treated equally on the same level as you and by comparing homosexuality to bestiality, yes, your attitude is anti-gay.

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    I believe every African country has the right to deal with any issue (homosexuality included) the way that best serves their needs, much the same way any states in US or province in Canada does!

    In Rwanda, it’s still a hot topic and we haven’t come any close to entertaining “anything” yet. You should respect that because it’s our country and we don’t expect anybody to tell us how to live especially that we can’t tell anyone how to live either!

    It’s Pathetic that someone actually mentioned Rick Warren, because this same topic was raised by first president -Gregoire Kayibanda- in 1968! This proves how ignorant most of you are thinking “just coz we’re westerners our views should prevail”! Well,… they won’t necessarily and should be at peace with it.

    Thank you

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    Another aspect of things to consider is that homosexuality has to be dealt with on a per culture basis because it cannot make sense in societies that understand human sexuality differently.

    In Rwanda for instance, seeing a woman’s chest twins (respect to our ladies please) is not as a big deal as it is in US! Trying to make these two people understand homosexuality the same way is realistically being stupid!
    So, when you put forward your ideas keep in mind who you are addressing them to and be prepared that THEY ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO ACCEPT WHAT YOU SAY!

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      You know what, Huan? I challenge you. I’m giving you a challenge.

      I dare you to post a comment explaining why you want to kill all Rwandans who are gay. No matter how many times you try to to dodge the issue, the fact remains that this legislation will enforce the death penalty upon homosexuals, and by supporting this bill, you are supporting the genocide of gay Rwandans.

      Why am I challenging you to do this? Because I know that you cannot do it. I’m still giving you the benefit of the doubt that somewhere inside your vast head of lunacy, you are in fact against killing your fellow Africans when they have done nothing wrong. But you choose to ignore it and not let it get in the way of your homophobia.

      Enough of that. I challenge you to defend the genocide of your own people. Why do I know you cannot do it? Because if you could, you would have done so by now. You have refused to move on from this comment thread after turning the entire website against you, choosing instead to post comment after comment full of your bottomless insanity, and not once have you touched on the issue of killing Rwandans because they are gay. It’s time you stopped hiding from it. If you’re going to call me a wimp and so forth, you had better have the ovaries to answer my challenge. Otherwise, you are not only the wimp, but also a bloodthirsty, soulless proponent of human slaying. And that’s enough of an offense for you to deserve to be kept in a padded cell forever.

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        Dagra Da,

        or should I say the openly lunatic? Look.. read carefully through my comments and tell me a single line where I say “rwandan homos should be put to death” Where? But this what I stand on and you’d better leave it that way coz by “challenging me” …huuu somebody save… you are actually making a fool of yourself.

        You challenge me to defend the genocide of my people. Or what? You make me sick with your attitude of thinking you can take on anyone with a different view! I think you’re fighting for “everybody to accept you”. Question: Do you accept those who think otherwise of you? Didn’t think so…

        I think homosexuality is not something to entertain and this has nothing to do with ” the death of my people”! How sick are you? I actually think you’re so paranoid about everybody “hating homosexuals” that you turn completely blank minded about anything because you feel so “vulnerable”.. Oh please GET OVER IT. You may spend your entire life and your kids(well,…) may keep on but the fact remains that not everybody will embrace your way the same way not everyone will like blacks,… Blacks are a race. Homosexuals aren’t. So, *** do not even compare, smarty ***!

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    My apologies to the whole community, my views are too strong here but it is not because they are, I think it’s coz some people (just a few of you) are less tolerant of others who may not be ready to accept everything you ask for!

    I am out of here but will keep reading you humour. It’s entertainingly sad to see some basics concepts twisted to the extent I found in this community!
    If you start with the wrong assumption, you can prove anything! I think most homosexuals are ridden with bad assumptions about heterosexuals. It is not about repressing you, it’s about not being forced to accept what you want, and you realizing that less than 5% of the population shouldn’t dictate the course of the rest 95%. (Don’t listen to the lie of 10%). I have more than 450 I interact with daily and I think only 4 are homosexual!

    http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/a02rStatistcs.html

    So long all o’ you!

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